Please note: This transcript has been automatically generated.

Rep. Angie Nixon: They said it was a stretch when our people wanted to be free, right? They said it was a stretch when people wanted to have 40-hour work weeks and wanted to have, um, weekends and child labor laws. They said it was a stretch when women wanted the right to vote. Everything is impossible until it’s not.

Jovian Zayne: Yeah.

Rep. Angie Nixon: I’ve defied odds before. Ashley Moody is very vulnerable. We can win this race.

Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Hey, y’all. It’s Brittany. So I wanted to start off this episode by cussing out that knuckle-dragging, Botox-filled troglodyte named Laura Loomer. I wanted to tell her to keep Ayanna Pressley, Angie Nixon, Ilhan Omar, and Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson’s name out her mouth, like she needs to delete her plastic surgeon’s number out her phone.

I wanted to tell her that those highly accomplished women have more talent in their left kneecaps than she has ever seen in her bad built life, and that jealousy, frankly, is a disease from which she is clearly slowly dying, because she looks like a puffed up crypt keeper every time I see her lying face.

But my mama listens to this, and so do my godparents, so I’m not gonna do that. But it did occur to me that there are plenty of people who are smart enough not to call any Black woman, let alone elected officials, ghetto Black bitches, at least not in public, but who still treat us like that’s exactly what they think of us.

People who spend a thousand justified headlines on Hasan Piker and never hold Laura Loomer accountable. People who will look the other way while six hundred thousand Black women are forced from the workforce, women like Claudine Gay, who are pushed out by white supremacists like Chris Rufo. People who will happily traffic in digital blackface and neck-rolling stereotypes in their texts or by welfare queen narratives, lock, stock, and barrel.

People who will call everyone from Kamala Harris to Ciara from Summer House aggressive just for telling the truth, even while my white friends on my old podcast networks will call investing money in Florida a waste now that Angie Nixon is the nominee because y’all refuse to believe that Black women are electable even when they win after being outraised 17 to 1, because guess what?

Black women are electable if you elect them. Yeah. All of y’all are trafficking in misogynoir, whether you talk like Laura Loomer or not. And guess what? Your collective refusal to respect, invest in, listen to, or follow Black women en masse now has all of us living in the ghetto. Laura Loomer ain’t nothing but a white refrigerator, and if you had elected the Black and Indian woman in the first place, Laura wouldn’t be up in the White House, she’d be in the trash where she belongs.

So while you check Laura Loomer, and you should, make sure you check yourself, because you damn sure have already wrecked yourself, and the rest of us too. I need for you to stay undistracted.

Coming up, Representative Angie Nixon on her run for US Senate. Y’all, Representative Angie Nixon just pulled off one of the biggest upsets in modern Florida politics. Running as a former union organizer, current state rep, and local bookstore owner, and a self-described unbought and unbossed candidate, shout out to, to Shirley Chisholm there, uh, Angie Nixon, a progressive, defeated establishment-backed Alexander Vindman in the Democratic primary for US Senate last month despite, and I want you to hear me clearly, being outraised nearly 17 to 1.
Now she’s set to face Republican incumbent Ashley Moody in November in a race national Democrats are watching closely. And yeah, we know Florida’s gone for Trump twice, but anything is impossible until it’s done. Okay? So if, or shall I say when she wins, she will definitely be making history in the US Senate.
So I’m looking forward to talking to Representative Nixon about how she defies party labels, what it means to govern beyond those labels, what she’s learned about running in a red state, and what it’s like to be in this very serious national spotlight. Representative Nixon, Angie, welcome to Undistracted.
Rep. Angie Nixon: Thank you for having me, Brittany. I’m so excited to be here.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: First of all, congratulations on your latest win. I need just three words about how you’re doing today.
Rep. Angie Nixon: Exhausted. Optimistic. But ready. Ready
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: I know you ready, ’cause you literally pulled off the road into a hotel so that we could have this conversation.
And I say congratulations on your latest win because this was not your first big upset. 2020 was a big one, too. You made a whole lot of people mad when you beat an anti-abortion Democrat incumbent to win your current seat in the state legislature, and not a lot of people saw that one coming. You definitely did your big one.
Looking back on that, what was your biggest lesson that you took from that win?
Rep. Angie Nixon: My biggest lesson that I took from that race was just, just keep running, keep campaigning regardless of what people say, regardless of the lies that they throw at you. Keep organizing, keep talking to people and letting them know what your vision is, which is a vision that they collectively came up with you, with me.
And so that is, that is what I’m doing right now. I mean, in that 2020 race, I had some really nasty things, some lies that were spread about me. Mm-hmm. And it’s reminiscent of what is happening right now, but I’m just gonna keep running. I’m gonna keep running my race.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: And you’re still running your race despite the fact that these folks have tried to censure you for being truthful on the floor.
I mean, when we, you, when you talk about learning the lesson of still running and still pushing and still moving forward, you brought that bullhorn on the floor to disrupt the vote on, uh, congressional redistricting maps, and something tells me you do not regret it.
N/A: A demonstration on the Florida House floor two weeks ago.
Democratic House rep and US Senate candidate Angie Nixon shouted through a megaphone protesting the new congressional map
Rep. Angie Nixon: I don’t regret it at all. The Republicans in, in power were simply trying to make it harder for regular people to be able to decide who will represent them, and they made it so that they wanted to choose who their voters were, which is something that was unconstitutional and illegal.
And it’s what we voted in a ballot, a citizen-led referendum. It’s what we voted against- That’s right … not allowing that to happen. And so I wasn’t gonna just sit idly by and allow them to do what they wanted to do. I decided to stand up for democracy and to stand up for the people of our great state, and then they decided to reprimand me.
But that is, that goes to show you that a lot of these lawmakers that are in power right now, they are corrupt. They’re adding- Mm-hmm … to the chaos. They’re trying to distract us, and I’m so happy I am on the Undistracted podcast. That’s
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: right. And
Rep. Angie Nixon: so I’m gonna keep pushing through and keep redirecting people to the things that we really need to be talking about and being focused on.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Fancy that, a representative actually trying to represent the people. Hmm. I just- Right … that, that’s so, it’s so interesting to me. Speaking of distractions, before we get into this race, and we’re gonna get into it, I have to ask you about old girl, and you know exactly which old girl I’m talking about.
There was a wild incident this past weekend. Conservative media personality, if we wanna call her that, alt- although I don’t think she really has one, Laura Loomer, she was completely out of line and out of pocket tweeting a segment from her show tagging you and other Black women in politics like Cori Bush and Ayanna Pressley, and even Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson, essentially name-calling you, um, that you were, uh, and I quote, “Ghetto, entitled, race-obsessed Black bitches who are completely unfit for power.”
My favorite though was that you responded, “Girl, you ate dog food on camera.” Like, what are we- … what are we really talking about? She has some random promo video where she in fact does eat dog food on camera. Um, and you added in the words of Queen Latifah, the great, “Who are you calling a bitch?” Right? So even Marjorie Taylor Greene called that lady out.
What do you think, and why do you think, um, that, that they’ve finally gone over the edge around this and just don’t even care at this point? And what’s your strategy for navigating this kind of vitriol?
Rep. Angie Nixon: They cannot stand on their policy. They cannot stand on what they have been doing, and so Laura Loomer was put out here in the universe, right- Hmm
the, the Twitterverse, to basically distract us from the fact that Ashley Moody, who was unelected, received her position, was appointed to be the US senator in the state of Florida because she stole $10 million- Hmm … along with Ron DeSantis and James Uthmeier, and they used money that was supposed to go towards medically needy and low-income kids.
They used it to defeat two ballot initiatives to put into two political committees because they wanted to stay in power and control of our bodies. And so, what we need to do is we need to say, “No more.” We need to push back, and I am- Yeah … avoiding getting in the minutia of it and getting distracted. Look I lost my, I lost my sister, my half-sister to suicide.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Mm.
Rep. Angie Nixon: And I know that Laura Loomer has been admitted to, um, you know, a hospital before because she spiraled, and I feel like she’s spiraling right now. She doesn’t really have any- Mm … support. A lot of the people that she used to hang out with, um, she has started attacking and things like that, and she needs help.
Mm. But that’s why I’m, that’s why I’m fighting so hard for universal healthcare, because-
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Mm …
Rep. Angie Nixon: I believe no one should go bankrupt and no one should have to worry about being denied access to treatment simply because they don’t have the money. And so Laura Loomer is someone that I’m fighting for- Mm … to make sure that she has quality healthcare.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: And that’s what I’m talking about, breaking news. Angie Nixon fighting for healthcare for everybody, even and including Laura Loomer. I, I, I appreciate that perspective, ’cause I’m just angry, but that’s, that’s why people like you need to run for office and not me, ’cause I’ll just cuss people out, and that’s not very helpful or productive.
But here you are. Um, we talk about this winning streak. We talk about you beating Alexander V- uh, Vindman when he outraised you, rather, 17 to 1 in this Democratic primary. There are people who are looking at you and saying, “This is a stretch. This is a red state. There’s no point in investing in this way.
There’s no point in running this race.” Why did you decide that a federal Senate run was your next best move, no matter who might disagree?
Rep. Angie Nixon: Because I have five kids with me and my husband, and we have a blended family, and too many times we lie awake at night wondering the type of country, the type of state that we’re leaving them.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Mm-hmm.
Rep. Angie Nixon: And I’m seeing and I’m witnessing Donald Trump with his hateful rhetoric and his hateful policies that have basically caused nearly 800,000 Black men and women to lose their jobs. They have caused our gas prices and our food prices and our Fashion Nova and Shein cart to go up.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: My, my, my.
Rep. Angie Nixon: Right? And it doesn’t have to be this way.
Also knowing that this dude has created and weaponized a federal agency to create a paramilitary force- Mm-hmm … to push the envelope. They are now allowed to slaughter us and murder us in the street with no, no accountability, no transparency at all. Yeah. And I know that he is making the case to not leave.
He’s already made the case about how they stole the election from him in 2020. He’s already said previously-
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah …
Rep. Angie Nixon: after he wins, there may not be another need to vote for another president, and he’s doing little things with ICE- To see and, and with the National Guard to see how far they can go and what they can get away- Yeah
and I am not okay with that.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah.
Rep. Angie Nixon: This is reminiscent of what my grandma talked to me about, how she had to be hidden during race riots- Mm … and when police was coming to, like, beat up the kids in Jacksonville during Ax Handle Saturday. Mm. And this is reminiscent of just all the bad things that we have seen.
And I’ve talked to some immigrants, some immigrants who came over 10, 15 years ago, and they told me that they are seeing signs of what happened in their countries and why they had to flee, when there was a rising dictator and authoritarian that came into power, and that- Yeah … just started enacting cruel legislation and policies.
And so, you know, the blood of my ancestors runs through my veins. Mm-hmm. And I am their wildest dream, and I- Mm-hmm … refuse to just allow them to actually try to put us back in chains.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah. Between making sure that folks don’t put us back in chains, and making sure that folks don’t put you in a box, I have seen you be so clear-eyed and vigilant, in particular since winning, as the media seems to really be obsessed with assi- assigning you a particular political label that w- they know gets clicks, right?
But you’re not trying to get clicks, you’re trying to get votes, um, so that you can, can lead Florida, um, in, in a different direction. And I think what’s been powerful is that every time I’ve seen you respond, you basically tell them, “Hey, you’re asking the wrong question.” Right? Mm-hmm. Exactly. What questions should the media be asking you when they talk to you?
Rep. Angie Nixon: The media should be asking me about how people are feeling. What do they care about? The tens of thousands of conversations that I’m having with Floridians, like, how are they making it? How do they feel right now in this moment? How do I plan to address those issues? Mm. And so right now, I’ve traveled across the state of Florida from the Florida Keys all the way to the Panhandle, which is a, a roughly a 12-hour drive when it comes- Wow
to some traffic in between. And people are struggling. They’re maxing out their credit cards.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah.
Rep. Angie Nixon: And the trauma that we are seeing that is happening, like, I am witnessing these news stories where people aren’t just taking their lives because they are depressed, they’re taking their children’s lives- Mm
and then taking their… And when I say children- Mm … I’m talking about some babies.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Have mercy.
Rep. Angie Nixon: This is not normal, and it should not be this way. And I refuse to just go along to get along and just write strongly worded emails. Respectability politics- Yeah … right now has gotten us in the situation that we’re in.
Mm. Right now we cannot continue to act as though these people that are in power are good adversaries, because if they were good adversaries, that would imply that they are acting in good faith. They are not. They are actively trying to destroy our communities- Yeah … our lives, and usher our children into the school to prison pipeline because- They make more money off of making sure our children don’t have proper education, and that they get funneled into school-to-prison pipelines so that they can go- Mm-hmm
into these for-profit prisons where they can be free or, or cheap, very cheap labor.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Labor,
Rep. Angie Nixon: yep. And I am not okay with that. I am not okay with that. I will never be okay with that, and I’m gonna fight against it at every, every step of the way.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: You know, I had a conversation with our friend Angela Rye a couple of episodes ago really about this and all of these labels that folks are trying to assign people.
Meanwhile, what she and I agreed on is that the people really don’t care what the label is, what, uh, you, what, what part of the spectrum you say you’re on. The question is, what are you going to do for me? What are you going to do- Exactly … for me as my family suffers, as I suffer? And you’ve been really clear about what your opponent has not done in the state of Florida.
What are some of those places where you are hoping to, um, really fill the gaps for Floridians that are s- not, that you feel are not currently being met by the incumbent?
Rep. Angie Nixon: So yeah, one of the things is, uh, as I stated earlier, medical debt is the leading cause of bankruptcy. People are literally going bankrupt simply because they’re trying to stay alive.
And so number one, on day one, I’m gonna file legislation to extend the ACA subsidies, which would allow 440,000 people that Ashley Moody voted against and caused- Mm … to drop off of the, uh, Affordable Care Act, the Obamacare role, marketplace, and allow them to come back on, and it’ll help drive down our healthcare premiums, because private insurance is going up too, due to the failure of the ACA subsidies to be extended.
And then we’re gonna make a hardcore push towards Medicare For All, universal healthcare. A recent Yale study came out that stated that if we were to enact universal healthcare in the, in the country, that we would save a trillion dollars annually. Mm. The only people that are upset about this are insurance companies, and I don’t give a damn what they think because they are denying people life-saving medical care because they’re worried about their bottom line and their profit
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: margins.
Yeah.
Rep. Angie Nixon: So that’s number one. Number two, we need to repeal this big BF bill. It was not beautiful. Yeah. It was bad because it gave these massive tax breaks to these very, very, very ultra wealthy rich people. Uh, and it allowed them to just, you know, again, make more money and save their money. And so I wanna repeal those tax breaks, repeal that big BF bill, and remove these working family taxes in the form of tariffs.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Mm-hmm.
Rep. Angie Nixon: These tariffs have caused so much grief for us. Everything is so much more expensive.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Truly.
Rep. Angie Nixon: And it’s because Donald Trump put these damn tariffs on everything, and so we need to repeal those. And then lastly, I am a mom of five, as I stated, and I have a five-year-old, and we’re just coming out with, like, childcare.
Mm-hmm. And so I am fully supportive of universal childcare. For every $1 the government spends, it puts three more dollars back into the economy because it allows parents to be able to get back to work and allows children, again, to have a strong foundation and not be ushered into the school-to-prison pipeline.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: What I really appreciate about this run you’ve been on, um, is that you’re showing up authentically as yourself. Like, you know, bookstore, locks, talking how you talk, doing what you do, even in the color pink, right? And The New York Times even just put out an article. What role do you think the color pink has played in your campaign so far?
Rep. Angie Nixon: I mean, it’s, it is just branding. Folks know it’s me. And it’s also, it’s also a sign of defiance because- Mm … the typical colors are red, white, and blue- Mm … and, for campaigns, and I just chose to do something different. I chose to do something different when I ran back in 2020. We have the same colors, which are pink and yellow, and it stands out, and it is an act of defiance
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: I love it.
Before I let you go, there are plenty of folks who still see this as a stretch. There are people who think that it is not worth people’s time and money to invest in your race in Florida. Some of those folks are behind podcast mics. Plenty of those folks are on social media. Mm-hmm. Um- Some of those folks might even, you know, be in the party.
What do you have to say to those folks who tell you to sit down and wait your turn?
Rep. Angie Nixon: I would say that they said it was a stretch when our people wanted to be free, right? Mm. They said it was a stretch when people wanted to have 40-hour work weeks and wanted to have, um, weekends, and child labor laws. They said it was a stretch when women wanted the right to vote, when Black people wanted the right to vote.
They said it was a stretch when we wanted, women wanted the right to have, the right to choose what they can do with their bodies. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And as you stated earlier, Brittany, everything is impossible until it’s not.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah.
Rep. Angie Nixon: I’ve defied odds before. Ashley Moody is very vulnerable. We can win this race.
And if anything, I’m going to help build out an infrastructure and usher in a new vision for our, for our future, for the next 250 years, one that is collectively built and created by everyday people. The only people that don’t wanna support me are the ones who are beholden to these billionaires or to these- Mm
corrupt corporations, because they wanna stay in power. I am someone who believes in a multiracial working class, and believe those are the people that should lead. Hardworking everyday people should get to shape what our communities look like and what our economy look like. And so if you fully support that, if you believe that our school bus drivers, janitors, you know, construction workers, nurses- Mm-hmm
teachers, if they should be the next leaders, because think about the type of policies that they would put out.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah. If
Rep. Angie Nixon: you think that is what we should be doing, and the type of leadership we should be ushering in, you’ll support my campaign for United States Senate. And so I’m asking everyone to tap in.
Go to angienixon.com. Sign up to volunteer and sign up to donate to our campaign. I do believe organized people will beat organized money each and every day of the week. However, we are up against a lot of money, and so we definitely need some organized money as well, and we want people to lean in. And this is not about if I can win.
This is about if we are ready to win, if we are ready- Yeah … to do something different and to no longer just survive, but to actually thrive and flourish.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Representative Angie Nixon, thank you so much for being such a courageous part of the we.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: We are rooting for you and excited to see all that you’ve got coming for us.
Talk to you real soon. Thank you so much, Brittany. Thanks for coming on Undistracted.
N/A: Yeah.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Thank you.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: All right, all right, all right. I’m joined today for Untrending News once again by our group chat bestie, CEO and executive director of the National Black Justice Collective, Dr. David J. Johns. And this is an exclusive, y’all.
I just want you to know- What? … this is, like, a very early preview, and you all should feel so blessed- Blessed … to have this on Undistracted. Hallelujah. We have executive coach and author of the new book, Soft Landings for Hard Days: Wisdom, Companionship, and Guidance to Encourage Your Spirits, the Jovian Zayne.
Pew, pew, pew, pew. Braa! Hey.
Dr. David Johns: You are, you are a published authoress.
Jovian Zayne: I
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: mean- Come on …
Jovian Zayne: authoress, wow.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Authoress. That’s such a- Hey … that’s a Black way to say it, authoress. It
Jovian Zayne: is. It is.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: I also just think that people should know that two of the eight godparents in my ch- children’s lives are, are represented right here. So like this is a real for real group chat.
Like we be really sending each other things. Yes. Very much so. Just like we do with Coop. So we got a whole lot to get to, but first of all, we have to talk about the administration’s attempts to curb mail-in voting. Let’s fast-for- let’s rewind rather back to March. President Trump signed an executive order calling on the Department of Homeland Security to make citizenship lists for each state that would determine voter eligibility for mail-in voting.
Now a whole bunch of states and Washington DC sued because they were like, “Hell nah, y’all not finna get all that information.” And also, um, this whole thing that you’re making up about, uh, undocumented people voting all the time and using mail-in voting to fraud the system, yeah, it really doesn’t happen.
So they sued in response, and last week the Supreme Court ruled that the lawsuits against Trump’s action were premature because this new rule and system hasn’t been form- formulated and fully shared yet. But even if the new rule were finalized tomorrow, it’s hard to imagine how such a massive effort could be implemented by the midterms.
But still, it’s a key story to be aware of because they’re certainly trying to make that happen, and they’re definitely trying to create chaos, confusion- Mm-hmm … and all manner of disorder to tip the scales in the Republicans’ favor. Democrats vote by mail more often, with one in three doing mail-in while one in four Republicans uses mail-in votes.
In some of the most key races this year in places like Michigan that have the highest mail-in voter usage in the entire country. Mail-in voting y’all already know is of course a, a key issue of accessibility for disabled and elderly folks, for working class people who don’t have flexibility in their schedules to go to the polls, hell, people with children who don’t have flexibility to go to the polls.
David, what do we really need to understand when it comes to protecting and promoting mail-in voting right now? Like basically, what the hell we ‘posed to do? ‘Cause he messing with the post office, he’s messing with the mail-in ballots. Mm-hmm. And this is all clearly an attempt to defraud the American people.
Dr. David Johns: There are at least five things that we can do right now in this moment, and the ancestors would have it I just published about this on my Substack at Dr. David Johns.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: You did.
Dr. David Johns: One is protect your voter registration right now. On your phone while you are listening, on your computer while you are watching.
Mm-hmm. I’m not talking about next week or this weekend. As Brittany just said, Homeland Sec- Homeland Security is building a federal citizenship list and handing it to states, and you wanna find out if you’ve been flagged in August, not in October. That’s
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: number one. Or November when you’re at the ballot box.
Dr. David Johns: At the ballot box. Yeah. Especially if you don’t have the ability to be in the state to correct it. The second thing is to request your ballot the first day that your state allows you to do so. Mm-hmm. Every day you wait is a day that you are betting on the mail and not on the courts at the same time.
Mm-hmm. Sign whatever you submit the same way that you have always signed it. This is incredibly important for- Yeah … Black women, especially Black women who are married and who have- Yes … a new signature. That’s number three, is to sign it the way that the state has your signature. Mm-hmm. Number four, to find out today whether or not your state lets you cure a rejected ballot, and what the deadline is for that process.
And then the last thing is if you are going to vote by mail-in ballot, hand-deliver it, and take somebody with you. Mm-hmm. Look for a, a dropbox or election offices, not the mailbox, right? Carry a neighbor, an elder, a first-time voter to help alleviate some of the challenges that we should anticipate- Yeah
based on what they’re doing. To your point about data, I want us to be clear why they are targeting Black folks in this regard. Washington’s audit found that Black voters’ mail-in, mail-in ballots were rejected four times more than white voters. Yep. That’s one in every 40. And every single one of those rejections came down to a signature.
Not fraud, but handwriting. And we should be clear that a, a person signs their name differently at 58 than they might have at 22, and the state is calling that the reason why a vote doesn’t count. Mm-hmm. So, and this is in North Carolina. We’ve seen this at more than twice the rate. Florida flagged Black, Latino, and Asian voters at twice the rate of white voters, too.
And the vice is that we get squeezed between mail-in challenges and then standing on lines where they’re making it harder for us to exercise these hard-fought rights. And so-
Yeah …
the very last thing that I just wanna end with is curing is a sleeper for us in this moment. Mm. You should ask if your state allows it.
If not, there might be an opportunity to advocate for. There’s always an opportunity to advocate for. Mm-hmm. But North Carolina’s curing rules let nearly 20,000 voters- Mm-hmm … the vast majority of which are Black, look like us- Right … fix a ballot or switch methods in time to know that their vote was counted in the election.
That’s a whole congressional district saved by a policy that nobody campaigns on. And so I wanna end by affirming for folks that the system is working exactly as designed. Mm-hmm. Shout out to Bryan Stevenson, you are not crazy. They’re working overtime to try and steal our votes, because they know how important they are.
Mm-hmm. And it is important for us to exercise the rights we have and to demand protections that we should have access to.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Jovian, it occurs to me that there are so many people who, um, don’t understand that our vote is under this really intense attack, right? Mm-hmm. There are people who have clocked out of that system.
They’re like, “Ain’t nothing gonna change anyway.” Mm-hmm. There are folks who are, like, you know, uh, thinking and taking for granted that they can just show up and get that mail-in ballot, that they can just show up on Election Day and make their voice heard. You are, in my opinion, one of the queens of group chats, ’cause you know how to get a message out to the people, okay?
That’s right. The live system gonna get the message, the family chat gonna get the message, Wonderland- Mm-hmm … gonna get the message. Everybody gonna get the message. Yeah. What is the message that you are sending out about this election season to people who are politically inclined, and especially people who are not?
Jovian Zayne: Yeah. Well, I think the first thing I’m doing today, which I’ve already got teed up, is sending over David’s gr- estab- like, incredible article from Substack. Yeah. The piece that you offered us today, David, I told you this, but it is completely clear and accessible. The next steps are immediate, but not overwhelming, like the context, right?
Like, you make the context in the way that you are a great teacher. Mm-hmm. Bite-sized for us to feel like we’re still human in the midst of systems that are constantly dehumanizing us. Thank you. When we think about what’s really hard about this current election cycle, it feels overwhelming, but that’s the whole point.
We know this. And so the thing that I think is so critical, and I’m glad you brought up the group chat, B, is because this is how we keep each other tapped in. It’s the small- Mm-hmm … mic race. So the message- Mm-hmm … I’m saying is very clearly, “Hey, y’all. This is what I did today. I took six minutes to read David’s Substack, I took two minutes to digest it, and I took three extra minutes to follow up and take the actions.”
Like, I literally put, “These are the steps. This is what I’ve done, and here’s the outcome.” Yeah. I now know I’m completely still registered to vote in California. I actually realized my license was about to be expired, so I’m making sure- Ooh … I follow up on that. Shout out to you, David, for keeping me in check.
Um, but, like, I let people know, “Okay, I’m registered to vote here, and also, here are the links I’m going to to continually- Mm-hmm … stay up to date on my registration. And also, here are the people that I’m reaching out to next.” Right. “Join me,” right? You know, I let them know very clearly, “Here’s what I’m doing.
Here’s what I invite you- Yeah … to as
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: well.” That join me is the key, right? Because- Yeah … there’s so much research out there that shows us when people have personal outreach from folks that they love and trust and believe have their best interests at heart, they go vote. So the texts- Yes … are not nothing, y’all.
They are extremely important. We can put all the commercials on the air, we can put all the links out there, we can do all the social media content, but somebody’s going to be reached because you sent the very text that Jovian just talked about. So secondly, y’all, we were on hiatus the last two weeks, and in that time- Oh
the Lord done called Dolly home. Oh! Dolly! No way. I’m
Dr. David Johns: mad. And that man is right there. He is still right there.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Dolly. I’m over here like, “I wanna talk to the Grim Reaper.” G. Reaper, holler at me ’cause I need to see your list. You taking- Period … all the wrong people. In particular, you taking the wrong white people.
Period. Hayden Panetierre Hear, Dolly Parton. Like, I don’t… Dolly didn’t do nothing but sing us beautiful songs, write us even more beautiful songs, entertain us- Advocate for us … make sure children read- Yes … um, help people can ride good rides, promote Tennessee, support Black folks and LGBTQ folks. I mean, she rode for everybody.
I don’t know that there’s anybody as universally loved as Dolly Parton. And Tressie McMillan Cottom put out a great video ’cause she was like, “I’m not only grieving Dolly- Yeah … I’m grieving the fact that I worry that our society as it stands is not building more Dollys.”
Jovian Zayne: Yeah, not producing.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: And I’m just like, “Tell me what a homegoing service is.
I’ma wear the biggest wig I can find.” Oh. I’ma push the girls up. I’ma snatch up my waist- Girls gotta
Jovian Zayne: be
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: up and at attention … and I will out Dolly one Dolly Parton- Listen … because I love that lady and she loved us.
Dr. David Johns: She did.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: David, what are we supposed to do without Dolly? I just, I, I, I, I, I don’t know. She impacted us in so many incre- I mean, we got the Moderna vaccine for COVID-19.
Who, ’cause of who? Dolly. Y-
Dr. David Johns: we did, and I was holding up a book. I’ll hold up another one, a children’s book, because we’re also talking about a woman who mailed millions of children books. That’s right.
Yep.
Um, and they will have the gift of literacy and have been introduced to windows and mirrors of possibility.
Um, and they might not even encounter her music, and so I want us to be clear that… Actually, I think the best thing for me to do in this moment is to back away and give this to Jovian, because when I think about her book- Mm.
Mm …
Writing Soft Landings- Mm … Dolly lived that life a- as a- Yeah … as a white woman from a small town in Tennessee who- Yep
uh, was intentional about choosing the very things that people said she shouldn’t and what otherwise are traditionally shame and stigma to it. She took all of those things and created so much beauty and so much difference in spaces that said to her that not only was she not obligated to do it, but that she would be better if she didn’t, and I feel like that is what a soft landing looks like-
Jovian Zayne: Mm-hmm
Dr. David Johns: when somebody builds a life on purpose. So let me give this to Jovian.
Jovian Zayne: You better tee it up.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: That was perfect.
Jovian Zayne: It was, but- What you think,
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Jovian?
Jovian Zayne: I mean, David, what you said is so, uh, honest, and it feels like- such a reflection of the truth of Do- Dolly’s lived experience. The thing that I, I’ve reflected on and I, as I just kinda sat with the fact that, wait, she’s gone, and I, I felt pierced by her death.
Never met Dolly, ain’t been to Dollywood. Mm-hmm. But I immediately called my mama, and my mom was so sad, too. Mm-hmm. Which I think says something, because I know it’s not just that my mom would be sad, my aunties are sad, my grandparents- Yeah … are sad. Like, Dolly Parton really was intergenerational in the way- Yeah
that she reflected our humanity. She was bold. She was honest. She was a giver, and the way that she was so generous in how she lived, she was the kind of generous that gave permission to others- Hmm … to live. Like, to live fully to yourself, which I think, and I reflect on this in my book, this idea of really giving to yourself is coming back home to yourself.
Hmm. Coming back home to who you were divinely created to be from the very beginning, someone who’s always had permission to take care of yourself. Because when you do that, honestly, most authentically and divinely, you’re not only being a good steward of yourself, but you’re being a good steward of the world.
Because each of us has such- Ugh … a unique and specific and necessary part to play in how we can coexist in this great universe that we, you know, currently inhabit. So, when I think about Dolly Parton and, like, the Imagination Libraries. Yeah. My God, right? David, you held up those books. Both books I know you’ve gifted to our family for Georgie.
Yeah. And I know likely the same for you, too- Yeah … and M&M, Brit. But, like, the idea that her extension of generosity allowed other people to create more worlds, to find more worlds- That’s right … to, to, you know, buck a system that would say, “Nah, your tits shouldn’t be that big. You can’t actually take a knife to your body.
You shouldn’t do this. You shouldn’t- Mm-hmm … you should actually let this other man sing your song,” right? “You should give over your rights,” and her to say, “Nah, I’m, I’m controlling my publishing because I’ve gotta create a legacy for my family.” Yeah. That’s important for her to know how to do that as a woman.
Um, I just, I think that her boldness created so many soft landings, which, as I describe, soft landings are the ways that we have community, the practices, the mindsets, and the behaviors that help us to honor our humanity and to encourage- Hmm … our spirits, and she did that in the way that she- Hmm … lived so publicly for us.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Jovi, I wanna stay there before we go because I’m so excited about your book-
Dr. David Johns: Yes …
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: coming out in October, and I’m excited about it- Mm-hmm … not just because I’m your friend, not just because I’ve had the chance to read it and it’s incredible, not just because I’m, like, excited for people to have the wisdom and the care and the kindness and the soft landing that you are for so many of us in their pocket.
Like, everybody gets a pocket-sized Jovi, and I’m very excited for them. I’m also just really excited for it because- When you talk about Dolly and the way that her boldness made space for humanity, it feels like life is squeezing the humanity out of all of us right now. Mm-hmm. I mean, hell, I, I will admit I started off this episode giving a Christian cuss out to Laura Loomer, right?
Who decided to fix her mouth and be deeply disrespectful to so many of our sisters and elected officials. And it looked big,
Dr. David Johns: it- Fuck Laura and everything she stands for and anybody around her, and if there’s a man protecting her that wanna run it for her, holler at me. And
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: all of that. And all of that, right?
And when we’re done-
Dr. David Johns: Oh, disrespect the …
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: with all of that-
Dr. David Johns: Which-
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: How do we give ourselves back to ourselves so that we can truly remain undistracted because we’ve found the soft landing- Mm … for all of these political, social, cultural, religious, economic hard days we find ourselves in?
Jovian Zayne: Yeah. Well, I’ll say this, Brit.
One, you and David already reflect these practices, but I’m gonna highlight them just for your own digestion and reflection in this moment, and for everybody who’s listening. The group chat is so critical. Mm. Because the group chat isn’t just a part of what we do on the phone, but it is how we’ve gotten over for centuries.
It is how we as a people, we’ve… Uh, the group chat, you know, is something now that’s technological, but it’s been in k- at kitchen tables, it’s been on pews, it’s been in living rooms, it’s been on the back of buses where we have communed- Yeah … where we’ve talked, and where we’ve decided that part of how we are harder on systems and softer on ourselves is that we remember we don’t go through this alone.
Mm. That’s the thing, right? Like, we find a softer landing when the systems that have said, you know, “You do not matter,” that you can’t get lunch, that you should- Mm … work, overwork yourself and then I’m gonna blame you for the burnout. Mm. We have to stay in community so we can remember what’s real, so we can remember that we d- are divinely assigned to rest, so we can- Yeah
remember that we are divinely assigned to honor the different seasons of our life so we’re not outrunning our lives or trying to hang on for dear life, but we are enjoying what is our dear life. What’s so important about finding and honoring the soft landings that are necessary for these very hard times that we’re living in, part of it looks like these five invitations that I offer people in my book.
The first one is to be gentle with yourself. This world does not want us to remember that we are still the precious human beings, the precious children that we once were when we were just born. It wants us to use the rough hands that would say, “Overwork yourselves, burn out-” Mm-hmm. “… keep going when you know you’re tired, s- you know, exhaust yourself into oblivion.
Don’t, you know, try to work within these systems that are not for you.” It wants us to be harder on ourselves, right?
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Yeah.
Jovian Zayne: My invitation is to remember to be gentle in your language, in your mindsets, in your everyday practices, right? Be gentle in the complications that are your life. Mm-hmm. My second invitation is to feel your feelings.
You all know this. Mm. All of us are very, we’re therapized, but part of what happens, we will be in a place where we will over-intellectualize our emotions, right? Yeah. We will, right, but we’ve got to remember- I’m the queen of
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: that.
Jovian Zayne: Listen, we could talk it through. Mm-hmm. I swear I have a doctorate, right? I have my BA in psychology but really went the rest of the process.
I know all the things to say. I got
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: all the things.
Jovian Zayne: All the things. Oh, yeah. Every single thing to say. But this invitation to remember to be soft on ourselves and to be gentle is to feel our feelings again. Mm-hmm. The world is trying to tell us, “Don’t be angry, don’t be sad, don’t be complicated in your emotions.
Just be okay.” That is what’s killing us, this pressure- Mm … to be okay, right? This third invitation is to believe you’re worthy.
Dr. David Johns: Hmm.
Jovian Zayne: Part of what I know, and I’m an executive coach, you all have experienced me in that capacity, but also have seen me work, but I’m telling you what I’m seeing all the time for executives at the most senior levels.
I’m talking about- Yeah … C-suite to entry-level, particularly with Black women, especially as we have been pushed out of corporate America. Mm-hmm. We’re dealing with a crisis of worthiness- Mm … where we are second-guessing everything about ourselves. We are taking beginner salaries because we don’t even believe- Uh-huh
we’re still worthy of the experts. We are questioning everything. Again, that’s a failing system. It’s not us. Mm-hmm. But it’s an invitation to do the work, to hold ourselves sacred, to remember that we’re worthy. Mm-hmm. And the fourth invitation is to honor the seasons of our life. That looks like, and you know this, BB- Hmm
when you step into the new role of parenthood or- Oh … David, when you become partnered in this next season, which you already are- I am … but, right? But, like, when you take on this role of like, okay- Yeah … saying, “I’m married,” life is asking something of you. You’re asking- Mm-hmm … something of you. Your future self is.
That means we’ve gotta readjust and realign what our priorities are, what our expectations are. Yeah. And so it looks like not outrunning the day’s capacity, because we said we once would, but it’s reassessing- Yeah … how do I rightsize what I need for the day? The last invitation, kinda my favorite, you all have heard me read from this, uh, but it is to appreciate life’s goodness.
Hmm. So it’s for, it’s remembering how do you appreciate life when you fall in love, you know? For the day it does turn out better than expected, for the day people- Hmm … vote the way they should, right? For the day that people hold up their end of the bargain, um, and you’re left wondering, was it that good?
And then you say, “Yes, it was,” and you appreciate- Yeah … it and you keep the goodness going. So all of this is about how do we honor the soft landings that we can so easily access for our hard days.
Dr. David Johns: You better get this book. You better
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: get you a copy. It’s just like you knew or God knew-
Jovian Zayne: God knew … to
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: use you as a vessel, that we would need this book at this time in our collective existence, because nothing- Yes
feels soft right now. No. And the reminder that we can give ourselves the softness that we need, that in community we can find what we need- Mm-hmm … is so necessary. ‘Cause baby, if a so- if the capitalist got a hold- Woo! … to a soft landing, none of us would be able to afford it.
Jovian Zayne: Hello. Hello. That’s the thing, like, why I gotta pay for a weighted vest to feel soft?
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Come
Jovian Zayne: on. To what? Why, why, why, like, what do we do when our money is funny? Can we still- Oh … find a soft landing? And I’m arguing yes, we can.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: Mm. So. And I’m glad you’re, I’m glad you’re making the argument. I’m glad that you are giving us this balm to heal us. Jovian Zayne, Dr. David Johns, my in real life group chat and my Undistracted group chat, thank you all for joining us, and we’re all gonna go pick up Soft Landings for Hard Days on October 27th.
Dr. David Johns: Period.
Brittany Packnett Cunningham: It was Nelson Mandela who said, “It always seems impossible until it’s done.” Think about what it meant for that to be the person who said that. All of those years in jail, all of those years fighting for freedom for your people, all of those years repairing a country that once thought you to be a terrorist.
It always seems impossible until it’s done. Black women are electable if you elect them, because it always seems impossible until it’s done. A Black man named Barack Hussein Obama probably seemed like a very impossible, if not improbable, president of the United States, and yet it happened. So if that was possible, and Nelson Mandela’s presidency was possible, and Kamala Harris’ vice presidency was possible, and me having this conversation with you is possible, it ain’t no way that Angie Nixon being the next US senator from Florida is impossible.
Not if we make it happen. Thank you for listening. Thank you for being, and most importantly, thank you for doing. I’m Brittany Packnett Cunningham. Let’s go get free.

Our executive producers are Cindi Leive and myself, Brittany Packnett Cunningham.

Our producer at Collective Media is Douglas Forte with supervising producer Ryan Jones.

Our supervising producer at The Meteor is Taylor Hosking and artwork is by Bianca Alvarez.

This episode was produced with support from Liberation Ventures and The Meteor Fund.

You can follow me on all social media @mspackyetti and our incredible team @themeteor.